A Gaming Metaverse on The Horizon

[00:00:00] Limarc: Cool. Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of this week on planet internet. I'm joined by one of our superstar devs, Jefferson, Paige Jefferson. Hey, and also with our regular podcast, host Amy. Hello. Today if maybe our backgrounds gave it away. We're going to be talking about Metta versus a little bit about gaming Metta versus, but Metta versus in general.

And a part of the reason why is because on hacker noon right now, we have a gaming metaverse writing contest going on in partnership with the sandbox. So basically anybody can log onto hacker noon in the next three months and publish an article about metaverses and FTS game development. And you can be entered to win up to $2,000.

So please definitely do that. And speaking of our partnership with the sandbox, the first article today is about the sandbox metaverse. And I chose this one because it was like, it's pretty well summarizes, how people can make. Specifically on the sandbox metaverse but in the future, I think all metal versus that monitor.

Yeah. Are going to follow the same structure anyways. So it explains in general how the metaverse can be monetized much like how the internet was monetized. So this one is called why owning land on the sandbox could make you rich written by Raven heart. And it basically just talks about how the sandbox works, how their virtual land sales work, what you can do with the virtual land and how you can make money with that virtually.

And yeah, it's quite interesting. And if you're up to date on how Metta versus work, and if you're up to date with a sandbox, it's not a surprise, but I think it might've been a surprise to you, Amy. You're not that familiar with the sandbox. What did you think when you read this article? Yes.

[00:01:54] Amy: So I've only just started learning about the sandbox at Mehta versus in terms of Real estate that you can purchase, which is like what the sandbox is based off of.

And I thought this article is super interesting because. Something that I didn't realize is that the sandbox, when you purchase said piece of virtual land in the future, you will be able to rent that out to German people like a real property. And so I thought that was really interesting. And I think the premise is interesting in the sense that if you buy these properties, you're essentially saying that you're going to make some kind of showcase in there or like something.

Probably to sell people something, right? Like it's going to be some kind of like company website or something probably. So I think that a lot of people, or a lot of companies will probably rent out these spaces too. Do you know art galleries on there already games or some kind of interactive experience and could pay a pretty penny for them?

So really interest.

[00:02:56] Limarc: Yeah, like a, to summarize the few of the ways that the writer talked about making money on the sandbox is, as Amy said, renting out land to other people to use, you could host giveaways and contests on your land. And one of the big ones is selling ad space. Much like how the internet found monetization in the form of ads and how Facebook and social media found monetization of the form of ads, the metaverse will follow suit.

So that's one of the biggest ones. And aside from that, People can sell the land if you want it too much, like real estate. So if you were to purchase land on the sandbox or any metaverse, and if that metaverse becomes really popular, like how Fortnite or roadblocks became really popular, then the more people that are going into that, metaverse the more that land is worth and you can sell it for future profits.

Hopefully. What about a huge effort? Sorry.

[00:03:45] Amy: Jefferson, do you think that people are buying this or do you think companies are buying.

[00:03:51] Jefferson: I think both companies like for promoting them themselves or yeah create him some some some experiences so they can return those people to their websites or.

To their products, but also people to create experiences to share trade stuff. So I believe that they just on a, an early stage, but I see like a big future on that. And it's an interesting topic.

[00:04:22] Limarc: Yeah. As a developer, what interests you about the technology or what differentiates, like developing for the Meadows versus developing for the regular internet?

[00:04:31] Jefferson: The actual the matter verse allows people to have freedom, to create and to share. It's like a a digital universe where people can do basically anything. So it opened up this cope of the development. You, you create a system. Everyone can contribute. It's not just up to you to put things there.

So yeah, it's crazy and cool at the same

[00:04:55] Limarc: time. Yeah, for sure. For sure. And I think for people who don't are like familiar with blockchain Mehta versus, or NFTs using the sandbox as like an intro to metros is maybe not the best. So next I'd like to ask both of you, what was your intro to metaverse college?

Like we don't have to worry about the formal definition of metaverse. What was the first like community online that felt different to you? It wasn't the same as a normal game and it wasn't the same as just a chat room. What was your intro to like online communities like this?

[00:05:28] Amy: I love club penguin, which I've just recently thought about, which is why I made it my background, which is like a very like deep cut early two thousands game where you could walk around as a penguin and chat with people.

But this was, I feel like this was like in my MSN days, and I think that this was like the first instance where I was like, where it was super interactive with other people that I played as an online. Yeah. This also Neo, like I played Neopets pads a lot to you, but like the interaction between people wasn't as prominent.

Yeah, so I think club penguin might've been it for me.

[00:06:07] Limarc: Cool. Cool. And how about you, Jefferson? What was your intro to these kinds of communities?

[00:06:10] Jefferson: I think it was Habbo hotel. It was, it's still alive today. I found my 2009 account there. You could like work and talk to people see the rooms that they created.

You CA you could find super crazy stuff, which they built. So you could trade mobs and stuff. It was pretty, pretty crazy

[00:06:32] Limarc: at the time. Yeah, my intro as well. Jefferson, we bonded about it. Cause if you knew how the hotel you knew how hotel, nobody was like 10% and they were like, everyone was 200% in.

Yeah.

[00:06:45] Amy: Yeah. Did you ever play Webb, Akins? I was definitely too old for that. Like I was too old to play it, but I did because I had younger cousins and younger brothers. No, that's not with it. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Web cam. So you would buy these stuffed animals and the animal is, would come with a card and the card would have a code in it.

And then you would put the code into the game and then you would have the animal in the game and in real life. And obviously as a dog animal lover, I was like super into this. This was my life.

[00:07:19] Limarc: And like how much would it cost for those sort of things? Do you

[00:07:22] Amy: remember? Oh my gosh. Okay. Each animal used to be a like $15.

And I was spending all of my money on this and now they will sell them at, I've seen them in add the dollars. Literal dollar star for a dollar, like a Y

[00:07:41] Limarc: well, I asked that question cause that form of monetization like facing kids and like how well it worked for you. It's it was so similar for auto hotel.

I think Jefferson, you remember like owning furniture on Hubble hotel gave you the ability to create rooms and create experiences, but the furniture. Was it really expensive? Jefferson, did you ever buy furniture? No. Never.

[00:08:03] Jefferson: Never.

[00:08:04] Limarc: Yeah. There's the kids on have a hotel. I think 50 credits back in the day would have been something like $20 or so.

And with those 50 credits you could maybe buy I don't know, 10 chairs or something. Like it's not enough to build it.

[00:08:19] Amy: Oh, wow. Okay. Wait, and also to go back to the sandbox and give some context, how much is a piece of land going for,

[00:08:28] Limarc: if you get it's like a, so the sandbox does drops of their land, where you can buy it at like their normal going price.

But to be honest, I've never been able to get in there. So I've never experienced it, but if you go on their reseller market, it's crazy. Like it's, I think the cheapest plots I found were Like one Ethereum. So about like 4,000 USD was like the cheapest one I saw recently. Okay. Yeah.

[00:08:52] Amy: Still crazy. But 500,000.

[00:08:56] Limarc: It depends on how big, I guess if you bought like an entire acre worth, it might be. Yeah. But so what about these a matter of vs then caused you to want to buy. Buy things in it, because I remember in HaBO hotel, I wanted to, I wanted to be like the richest person there. I did all sorts of things.

What differentiates these platforms? Like Habbo hotel or club penguin from a normal MSN messenger or a normal forum board. What did you get out of it? That was different.

[00:09:25] Amy: It's the gamification, isn't it like these chat functions don't have gamification in it. Like I'm a son didn't have that other than a little pain or whatever.

Yeah. But it's like gamification, like with club penguin, there were multiple different games that you would play within it, and then you'd have to get like coins or something. And there was an objective of the game of some sort and you buy stuff with the money and it was a whole thing.

So like to keep going back because you've got money there, you got all your friends there.

[00:09:57] Limarc: No. Cool. How about you, Jefferson? What was the appeal?

[00:10:00] Jefferson: Maybe I think the experience of it, like I w I enjoyed exploring the rooms and all the experience that other people created people. Yeah.

Actually have cash because I haven't. So I was like wandering around and exploring, and I got jobs and stuff and they paid me sometimes they didn't.

[00:10:27] Amy: Is this like Sims?

[00:10:28] Jefferson: Yeah, you could. You pretend that you have a life when you work and yeah,

[00:10:34] Amy: These matter versus because the life in the Meadows is better than your real.

[00:10:41] Limarc: I wouldn't say, I said, I wouldn't say better, but I think it was more role-play there were tons of people who would like role-play being a family on a hotel. I joined an army and I was like, I went from a private in the army to like a corporate. It took me months to get there. It was like, yeah,

[00:10:57] Jefferson: that was wake up.

Police officer. And I was like wandering around dressed like a police officer and, pretending to be.

[00:11:05] Limarc: It was what amazes me about Habbo hotel and how it proves that the metaverse works is all these people made was a place where you could sign in to these empty rooms and a marketplace for furniture.

And the members are the one who created everything else. How about hotels? Come in and think, oh, we're going to build this place and there's going to be casinos. There's going to be armies. There's going to be like furniture games. They didn't know any of that would happen. It was made by the creativity of the community.

I think for me, that's like what separates a metamorphose from a regular game or a regular plan.

[00:11:39] Amy: So would you consider like a DS game?

[00:11:48] Limarc: Could you give an example of what DSG game or like a, what kind of

system?

[00:11:52] Amy: When I was younger, I used to play Nintendo dogs religiously. Of course the only games I'm interested in had animals in them. And in 10 dogs, you used to be able to take your dog to your friends house and then you could walk your dogs together.

Do you think that's a matter of verse?

[00:12:11] Limarc: What do you think Jefferson does account you're the developer.

[00:12:15] Jefferson: Yeah, maybe like a more limited version of it, but can be. I dunno. W would you create stuff

[00:12:24] Limarc: there, like in the universe or not really?

[00:12:27] Amy: No, actually that's not true. You had a house and then you would decorate your house, but it was pretty limited in like customization though.

And your dog would have its own color or outfit, and then you could have a different kind of a leash for your dog.

[00:12:47] Limarc: I'm on Deborah's inside here. I think it's but the there's so many different definitions of metaverse, but for me, the differentiating factor is can you create your own experiences? Not just like your own avatar or decoration, can you affect what's happening in the game or what's happening in the world?

Okay. But on that note one metaverse that did really well in that sense was fortnight, which is what our next article is a shameless plug. I did write this one, but not because I'm trying to toot my own horn, but it fits really well with this with this topic. So this article in a nutshell was about how Ford may defined from just being a battle Royale shooting game to a metaverse.

And the long story short is it basically became. The virtual playground that replaced. The basketball court had replaced the community center, where kids were hanging out and instead it'd be, this became where people hung out and it's not just kids. Parents, families. I used to play with an entire family, literally the father, the mother, and the kid all played at the same time and we played together.

So it just showed the ability to bring people together. And on Fortnite, you can customize your avatar. And you can create your own experiences. You can create your own games and create your own maps. But more importantly, they took it a step further in the sense that they created in game events, where everybody around the world would experience at exactly the same time, millions of people seeing the same concert at the same time, or seeing the same, a new addition to the map at the same time.

So creating this sentence. It's not just the game. It's a place to experience things with something Fortnite did well in its peak. Unfortunately, now it's died, but it proved how well Mehta versus work and how well they can be monetized, which is why we saw crossovers with Marvel, with star wars, all these big IPS, looking to advertise their stuff on fortnight.

Did either of you play fortnight Jefferson or Amy or played a game like it? I've never.

[00:14:41] Jefferson: No shame on me. Never played once I installed it, but then I uninstalled it before open it too. Yeah.

[00:14:49] Amy: Any interest in fortnight until Arieanna, Grande's started partnering with Bart at night, like a month ago, and now I'm like, oh wait, I could be Ariana's garage.

[00:15:00] Limarc: Yeah, exactly. It's cool. And Blake shows how well their marketing is and how well the metaverse works because everybody is trying to get advertised there. Like you just said that Ariana Grande, they want it to get advertised on there. Seeing things like this. Do both of you do both of you buy into the idea that the metaverse is going to be the next form of the internet?

Or do you still just think it's a bit of a buzzword,

[00:15:26] Jefferson: through myself. Do you think it's going to be the next big thing? I think like games as a service, like they always keep evolving and not like just release a new a game every two and three years, but they keep evolving again and again, and so I think companies always start to, but ads inside, so too, so they can monitor it.

But yeah, I think it that's the way it's

[00:15:54] Limarc: going.

[00:15:54] Amy: I feel like COVID and quarantine has accelerated the adoption of metaverses in the sense that you can't go outside, so I'm going to go into an online universe instead. So yeah, I think a job shit has increased. Excellent.

[00:16:12] Limarc: Do you have firsthand experience of that feeling?

Did you turn to all night committees during this time and did it work? Did you feel a similar sense of connection that you would in person?

[00:16:21] Amy: I, in over quarantine, I started playing among us with my friends, which like, I don't know if you would count it as a matter of hours, but I never, we have never gamed before, like ever at all of any kind.

It was nice to just be able to. Like having an event every week that we could chat at the same time and do something. Yeah, I think like even I got into it,

[00:16:47] Limarc: How about you? Jefferson does, did, was there online experiences that kind of replace the sense of connection for you that we couldn't get during this pandemic?

Yeah.

[00:16:55] Jefferson: On the pandemic, nothing changed much because I'm not a kind of a social person, but yeah. But yeah, I enjoy like JDA role-play. Because it can, the kind of, you pretend to be someone else and you have work and stuff like

[00:17:14] Limarc: that, but things haven't changed much.

[00:17:19] Amy: That's so funny. I was like, when we went to court and he was like, I'm dying.

I need my socialization. We needed to have once a week among us nuggets, we needed to do all of these different things online because I can't see people in person.

[00:17:32] Limarc: No, I'm the same as you Jefferson. For me, it's oh, now I can play video games all day and nobody judges me like it's perfect.

Cool. So speaking of Metta versus one of the companies that have been really talking about it recently and have been making a headlines is Facebook, which is what our next article is about. It's on seeking alpha and it's titled Facebook is the king of the metaverse. In a nutshell, lots of this article was about stocks and like the stock markets aspect of metaverse and our Facebook is using it, not just.

For fun, they're actually doing it as one of their main, like value adds. And they're transitioning from just being social media to a metaverse company. One of the quotes from, I think he said it was one of the Facebook's investors talks or something from Zuckerberg said that he wants the world to stop seeing us primarily as a social media company, to seeing us as a metaverse company, which is a huge thing to say.

He means they're applying to pivot completely into the metaverse and It was basically about the author talking about how this might have affected Facebook stock and what the metaverse means, but I'm interested to see what you thought of this Jefferson. Yeah,

[00:18:43] Jefferson: Facebook almost reaching 2 billion users.

If they do that transition, they will be like the best metaphors around and they have. This whole commute community stuff. Like they have communities, you can talk to your friends, you can post everything. You can, you have the marketplace, they got into that

[00:19:08] Limarc: virtual

[00:19:09] Jefferson: reality goggles.

Kind of the way to go. They have the player base, they have the users there. So it wouldn't be like it wouldn't

[00:19:20] Limarc: be like a bad idea to head to the metaverse. I see. I see. So in general, you're saying that basically Facebook already has all the aspects of what it needs create a metaverse it has videos.

It has groups that people can make on their own pages. It has the usership. So you're thinking that Facebook has the ability to do it, but do you think it's a good idea? Do you think it'll actually work out. I do think,

[00:19:45] Jefferson: especially now on the pandemic, we do not know how things will go. If things will get better or not.

And since almost everything is starting to get digitalized and all those universes are being created, I think that's the way that Facebook should have.

[00:20:07] Limarc: Interesting. Interesting. What about a UME? Do you think Facebook walls stick to its guns and make this pivot? And do you think it'll work out?

[00:20:16] Amy: Yeah, I think it would be a smart move for them.

What I thought was interesting from this article was how it talked about Instagram and peace in this as well in the sense that if Facebook could really create a metaverse I imagined that. Corporate Instagram too, because it's part of their offering. But then part of this article talked about how they haven't really connected it too far yet because of legal reasons or something or logistics, or I don't know, they, there was a reason for why they didn't want to connect them yet.

But I think imagining a metaverse as like Facebook and Instagram combined, that would be huge.

[00:20:59] Limarc: And part of the puzzle you hadn't mentioned yet. Jefferson briefly mentioned was Facebook owns Oculus now, which is like one of the biggest VR companies in the world. I think they have sold the most VR units so that they could be considered the top VR company.

And I think that's the biggest change for the metaverse. Like one of the things. People talk about how it's not just the internet and why it's not just the internet. Why it's the evolution of the internet? It's the idea that you're not just looking at the internet on a screen. You actually go into it now.

So instead of searching for information on Wikipedia, In a metaverse maybe I would walk into the Wikipedia building and I would find that book on the shelf. I'm seeing that in my opinion, like the VR aspect is the most interesting part of it. Have both of you or have either of you adopted VR, have, are you playing VR games?

Are you interested in getting VR headsets or you're not there yet?

[00:21:52] Amy: I used to do I, and Ooh, I think it must've been probably 2050. And I went to a few VR conferences in Vancouver that were super interesting that had a bunch of different games and different use cases of VR, which were really interesting.

One of the things that I thought was really cool was that someone was building a fear simulator so that they would be able to overcome their fear of Heights. That was a fun. Yeah, lots of different aspects of VR that are really cool and could potentially become like metaverse like, although I can't imagine myself right now, like putting on a headset to walk around in a marketplace.

Metaverse, I don't know. It seems too far fetch for the technology of the mind.

[00:22:38] Limarc: I want to come back to that, but Jefferson, what about you? Do you adopt a VR right now? Are you using it? Not yet.

[00:22:45] Jefferson: I'm updating my reg to buy an Oculus, so yeah, but I do want, like to get into horror games and stuff like that in a VR might be super

[00:22:57] Limarc: cool.

Yeah, on that note though, you actually don't need an expensive rig. That's what, that was one of the biggest boundaries for people you'd have to buy a $2,000 computer than a thousand dollar headset. Facebook prices. The Aqua is cheap enough that it's cheaper than the PlayStation five. You don't need, you don't even need a PC anymore.

But if you want the best VR, you do need to be.

[00:23:18] Amy: Yeah, the audience actually is not even that bad. Like it's quite good. But I have tried on some VR assets have made me like ill, so I think, but this to be fair though, this was probably like six years ago. So I imagine that the technology has improved quite a bit for the lower end VR sets, but some of the cheaper end VR sets, I feel are a little dizzying.

[00:23:44] Jefferson: Yeah, I want to

[00:23:44] Limarc: test

[00:23:45] Jefferson: like those new games, like half-life Alyx and stuff and Regal, I would need to

[00:23:54] Limarc: Appreciate it. Yeah. Okay. And then you needed for sure. And one interesting thing about VR sickness. I. Out of everybody, I know in my life I get the most motion sick. So I was like, oh, is this going to work for me?

And in the beginning it was really bad. So I had to take the same pills I would take on airplanes to use it. But after a while, like I learned how you're not supposed to do that, you're actually just supposed to jump in head first and get your mind used to it. And eventually, yeah, seriously, like there are tutorials on the internet about how, if it's really bad and you play for 30 seconds, then you stop.

Then you keep doing that. And then eventually your mind disassociates what's, you're seeing on screen versus what's happening in real life and you don't get sick anymore. It just takes time for you. Oh, yeah, I can go flying down. I'm fine. Okay.

[00:24:42] Amy: Nice. All right. Good to know.

[00:24:45] Limarc: And Amy, you talked about how, you're not sure how this would work for our marketplace, but I think one of the biggest use cases is a marketplace because now instead of trying clothes on online, you could do that in VR is shopping for furniture.

You could do that in VR. Do you see that stuff as panning out in the future?

[00:25:02] Amy: I have seen that more in an application of AR though, are you familiar with I believe it's called rent the runway. No, they are a fashion company. And one of their I believe one of their storefronts in New York has this mirror that is you try on the clothes in the mirror and you don't have to like actually change, which is quite interesting.

[00:25:24] Limarc: That's really cool. One important aspect of this though, I'm sure everyone's ready player one is like the go-to pop culture thing. People talk about when they want to have a quick idea of the members that was like a dystopian idea of what the metaverse could be, but, that's better versus called the Oasis.

It was run by like the biggest tech company of the world at that time. It's looking like the biggest metaverse is going to be Facebook's, which is called Facebook horizon. And it seems pretty eerily similar. So you either, have you see any potential problems happening or do you think that's.

Fiction. And you think there's enough government regulations in place where we'll be okay.

[00:26:06] Amy: Nah, man, like this definitely goes back to the whole de-centralization movement of everything, right? Like the one big player is going to come in and make the big as a matter of our us. And then there's going to be no more sandbox and there's gonna be no more everything else because bass was going to take over everything.

[00:26:24] Limarc: Yeah. Jefferson, do you see a way where. We like as a developer, could there be safeguards built? Could we build this into these decentralized way? Where a main player like Facebook wouldn't have complete control? If everyone's using the metaverse the same way they use the internet, isn't it incredibly dangerous that just one company would own the biggest pile of it?

[00:26:44] Jefferson: I don't think so. I really believe that probably government will tap into a way, like they regulate those big companies too. Take over the world and stuff. So yeah, I think it will not happen. It will have space to like smaller Mehta versus, but they will not be as they will not have the power that those big companies

[00:27:11] Limarc: may, the vs will have.

[00:27:14] Jefferson: I think it will be around that.

[00:27:18] Limarc: I think you're very optimistic. I don't agree that the government has regulated company as well.

[00:27:23] Amy: Do they do they. Yeah,

[00:27:27] Limarc: I know, avoid

[00:27:28] Jefferson: using those big tech stuff, but I don't have Facebook or Instagram installed and all those stuff I don't know. I prefer to waste my time playing video games

[00:27:42] Limarc: instead of on social media.

Yeah.

[00:27:45] Amy: Facebook gaming, still a thing.

[00:27:49] Limarc: You mean like their Twitch kind of platform, like

[00:27:51] Amy: member Farmville?

[00:27:54] Limarc: I think it is. I think based on my games on there, for sure.

[00:27:57] Amy: Interesting. I have not played that since the early two thousands as well, but they had all different kinds of apps, right? Like with games within Facebook.

So maybe that's how they will transition to their metrics.

[00:28:14] Jefferson: Yeah, I think I dropped that.

[00:28:16] Limarc: I'm not quite sure. Yeah. I used to play poker on Facebook all the time.

[00:28:20] Amy: I played pet society, of course. Okay. It

[00:28:26] Limarc: was like, oh, it's still here, everyone. It's a little bit

[00:28:31] Jefferson: harder to find that

[00:28:34] Amy: the UI is a little outdated, but it's still there.

[00:28:37] Limarc: Yeah.

To end off here, what's a game or a platform that you'd want to see become a metaverse right away. What's the most interesting or exciting metaverse you'd want to enter. Let's

[00:28:52] Amy: bring back Neo pets.

[00:28:53] Limarc: Why deal pets,

[00:28:55] Amy: animals

[00:29:01] Limarc: pets, the money. If it was actually on Nintendo switch like this. That'd be amazing. What about you, Jefferson? What would you bring back on reverse? Do you want to enter to

[00:29:14] Jefferson: bring back? I'm not quite sure. I do have a game that I want to

[00:29:20] Limarc: become a metaverse which one.

[00:29:23] Jefferson: Absolutely grand theft auto that are some rumors that they are the next GTA will become a game as a service.

It will be like the last JV and yeah, they will be keep just updating the game. Yeah. Making improvements and stuff, real, so you'll never know, but it will be cool, to for sure, yeah. Create your character and do everything you want there and

[00:29:52] Limarc: stuff. For sure. For sure. For me, it's a platform called Koch music have either of you heard of it.

No. So it is a clone of Habbo hotel that was paid by Coca-Cola basically to promote their products, but to be honest, like Jefferson and Amy, like this, it was a much better than Habbo hotel. I don't know why I think it's because the furniture was cheaper. So you didn't have to spend endless amounts of money, but it was like the smartest marketing ploy.

Cause they have thousands of people. Sorry. I would say around a little bit after I have hotels. So maybe 2000 and 2005 to 2010 ish, she was popular, I'd say. And the main difference between Koch music and Habbo hotel was In order to gain like the money to buy furniture, which is all Coke branded.

You have to go into these main lobbies that had a bunch of people and one DJ in the middle of the room. And you would walk up to the DJ and play a song that you made. In the game. So they had this audio creation platform and everybody in the room, but either thumbs up or thumbs down your song and the more thumbs up you got, the more money you would make and then the next person would go up.

So it was like a, you were running your own concert? Yeah, I was good. I don't know if my music was good, but I learned how to hack the platform so I could duplicate furniture. So I shoot it a little bit. All right. Thanks for joining us today, everybody on this episode, this week on planet internet talking about the Metta versus once again, if you're interested in Metta versus please log on to hack commune, submit your gaming metaverse story and try to win some money.

I was your host today. Lee mark joined. Amy Tom and Jefferson Borba. And this episode was edited by somebody whose name? I forget. So we're just going to cut out.

This episode was edited by Alex. Thanks everyone. We'll see you next time. And

[00:31:58] Amy: also. Yes. Also, I would be remissed if I did not mention that you can use the power of technology to aid in Afghanistan support. So you can Google it to educate yourself more about the issues that Afghanistan people are facing as well as donate to the relief efforts to help support those people to get out of the country.

So we will put a link to a. A charity of some sort in the description of this episode, if you would like to donate.

[00:32:33] Limarc: Awesome. Thanks very much, everyone. We'll see you next time. Bye. Bye.